The first time I saw London-based American singer EMMMA, she was opening for Pale Waves at the Waterfront, Norwich. That evening I saw a performance assured and original enough to mark her as one to watch, even in the crowded space of female singer-songwriters.
This time I caught up with EMMMA via Zoom on a chilly November evening. I met an artist who is thriving after a rebrand of her musical identity and embracing a relocation to London. With tickets on sale for her first headliner tour in early 2026 and an album being written, the coming year should be a big one. With her engaging personality, honesty and songwriting talent, EMMMA has already shed the persona evident on her Secondary Character EP and is no longer feeling apologetic for who she is.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Great to meet you EMMMA, and congratulations on your first headliner tour!
EMMMA: Yes, thank you and I’m so excited. I announced it a few days ago and so far the reaction’s been amazing. So…Glasgow, London, Bristol, Manchester, next Spring.
THE INDIEPENDENT: For those who are new to your music, how would you describe your musical style?
EMMMA: A blanket statement is alt-pop but it’s looser than that. There’s not really a term for it. If you enjoy Phoebe Bridgers, Chappell Roan, Holly Humberstone and Sam Fender and you mix them all like a grunge fairy aesthetic, that’s me!
THE INDIEPENDENT: That is definitely a mix! It’s interesting because I picked up on those when I saw you, but I also felt to a certain extent that there was a Gracie Abrams vibe in there too. Are the people you mentioned your influences?
EMMMA: I don’t know if I’m influenced so much as I just enjoy them – I think my influences are more niche. Bon Iver is probably my biggest influence, and Phoebe Bridgers is definitely one for sure…Joni Mitchell and Stevie Nicks too—their ability to storytell has always been impressive to me. A whole blend of stuff!
THE INDIEPENDENT: There’s a strong and interesting mix in there. And you have an interesting story yourself; you chose to rebrand from Emma Charles to EMMMA. What did the shift mean for you artistically and personally? How has your career developed?
EMMMA: I was Emma Charles for six years. I was really proud of the music I put out under Emma Charles—that won’t change.I grew a lot artistically and emotionally from that project, plateaued with it and it didn’t allow me to take creative risks that I wanted to take. There was no way I was ready to cover my face in lyrics and cement myself into a wall, which is the visuals for ‘Wednesday’s Child’. I gained a lot of confidence and momentum over the past year and a half, and the rebrand allowed me to be my fullest, most creative self that wasn’t really afraid to take risks. I think Emma Charles was a little bit safe, and that’s why we pivoted.
THE INDIEPENDENT: And you felt it was easier to rebrand rather than transition?
EMMMA: Yeah, and I feel the people who liked Emma Charles wouldn’t immediately gravitate towards EMMMA so it just didn’t make sense to transition on that project. We decided to start from scratch, which was terrifying.
THE INDIEPENDENT: That was a huge risk!
EMMMA: A huge risk but so worth it. Every second of it was so worth it.
THE INDIEPENDENT: And the striking 3’M’ EMMMA, how does that reflect your current creative identity?
EMMMA: When we were doing the rebrand, we were throwing about stage names and monikers, and I cannot feel good about being anything other than myself. So it just had to be Emma. For me, being myself is the draw – some people and bands have wonderful stage names but I couldn’t do that. But, if I was just Emma with 2 M’s and you Googled that, you’re not gonna find me – so we added the third M.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Can you walk us through how a song like ‘Wednesday’s Child’ comes together? Do you focus on lyrics or the music first?
EMMMA: Concept and feeling first. I cannot go into a session without having a concept ready to go and I always try to think of it even on the way to the session.
After seeing a sticker that said ‘Wednesday’s Child’; I was intrigued and I looked it up and my ex was also born on Wednesday. I brought that concept into the session and said, “I need to write the song today”. We discussed what the themes were and what it meant to me, the chords came next, then the melody and then we wrote the lyrics over that.
THE INDIEPENDENT: So it’s normally the same process for everything?
EMMMA: Yeah, instead of being like, “Oh I’m so sad” and speaking it out loud, I will make a Google Doc to share in session. I will write an essay on the topic of how I’m feeling— a full paragraph, a big block, a chunk of feelings all written out, a stream of consciousness on the topic that I want to write about. We can then go through and pick out the lines that are intriguing to start a song.
THE INDIEPENDENT: It’s interesting that you talk about writing in session rather than just sitting in your bedroom or on a sofa and writing.
EMMMA: It’s usually in session. I do my best work when I’m surrounded by creative people. I struggle with solo writing because I get really distracted and go oooh [waves arms] so that I don’t finish anything! So when I’m in a session, I’m there to write and I trust the people I’m with, and it’s a collaboration for sure, but it always, always ends from my thoughts.
Sometimes, I’ll write a verse or a chorus at home and bring it to the session and say this is what I want to start with. That’s less usually what happens, but it has happened and we have gotten some really good songs from that also.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Who are you writing for? Is it for yourself or for the listeners?
EMMMA: It’s for me, I’m writing for self therapy. It’s like I am journalling to myself and I hope people resonate with that but I think you have to be a little bit selfish as an artist. I’m writing because it makes me understand myself better and the world better. And I think if it makes me feel that way, hopefully other people feel that way.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Being true to yourself feels like a recurring theme, from your rebrand to the way you write. Do you feel you’re not being true to yourself if you write for listeners?
EMMMA: I mean, look, I understand there’s a time and place for that, and people do do that, and they probably make a lot of money from it but, for me, I do think that if you’re an artist, your job is to tell your version of the truth.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Despite the very personal, introspective focus of your songs the synths make it sound expansive and almost cinematic at times. What influences help shape that?
EMMMA: I am really inspired by soundtracks but I think.. .the reason is that type of sound is what gives the full body shivers and if I don’t get a shiver from the song, I don’t put it out. I have to feel it in my gut. I don’t feel good about putting out a song if I haven’t been like “OOH” at least once!
THE INDIEPENDENT: You’ve talked about tips in terms of your Google Docs but how do you balance the vulnerability in some of your writing with the production polish?
EMMMA: I love to write a hook-y chorus, it’ll get stuck in your head and I know that’s less vulnerable, but I love a hook-y chorus. I think the verses are where you can get vulnerable and I can get really personal. In the chorus, I want that, “ooh, I’ll remember that song forever!”, and maybe that’s less vulnerable, but that’s my personal taste.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Which lyrics are you most proud of?
EMMMA: The second verse of ‘Morning’ is probably my favourite verse that I have. It’s a tiny song, not the big bang, but lyrically, it hits.
THE INDIEPENDENT: How would you say your sound has evolved from the Secondary Character EP to the Wednesday’s Child EP?
EMMMA: I was still playing it safe, there’s even a song called ‘Playing it Safe’, and that that EP was my transition from Emma Charles into EMMMA. Once I got over the whole being secondary thing, I was able to fully pursue whatever I wanted creatively, and it was the most freeing thing I’ve ever done in my life. This latest EP is just like, “I did not care: I can go as big as I want to go, I can go as small as I want to go” – I’m not pandering to anyone, this is the sound that I want to make. I can be loud and do whatever I want to do, and, and the album that I’m working on for next year is full of that, and it gets even bigger and I’m really excited about it.
I think I was apologising a lot – I’m not apologising so much anymore.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Is there a theme connecting the tracks on each EP or a message you are trying to convey?
EMMMA: I don’t plan a big theme, it is just what I’m feeling at the time although what ended up being the theme was growing through post-breakup.
‘Cut The Breaks’ was immediately when the breakup happened and the EP ended up detailing the process of grief post breakup, ending with ‘Cards’, which was acceptance, it wasn’t really intentional. ‘Morning’ is the reflection of when you know it’s ending and try to hold on a bit longer. ‘Whiplash’ is “oh, I’m single, what do I do?”, and ‘Burning Bridges’ is about people coming into and going out of my life.
THE INDIEPENDENT: When you pull all that together into an album, is that going to be a challenge?
EMMMA: The album is just about my feelings as I navigate life, post break-up. It’s kinda like BC and AD—BR and AR for relationships.
THE INDIEPENDENT: Is there a track that you have released so far that is an indication of what the sound is going to be?
EMMMA: I feel like a blend of ‘Wednesday’s Child’ and ‘Whiplash’ is probably a good indicator of what it’s going to be. There’s more pop in it, but it’s also darker – it’s a blend and I think it’s just less apologetic and stronger and I back every song with every bit of my being.
THE INDIEPENDENT: You have been touring with Pale Waves, how has that experience been?
EMMMA: It was amazing—honestly the best experience of my life. I had toured before, but not at this level. We shared a bus with the band so I even had to learn to sleep on a bus with sixteen other people, but I learned fast. My biggest takeaway was that my music touched people who had never heard of me before and I didn’t know anything about them yet they felt inclined to tell me. It made me feel really connected that I was able to help people through whatever they’re going through.
THE INDIEPENDENT: It’s a beautiful takeaway. Your set really showcased your style, your outfit, the cool white instruments, switching between guitar and keyboard, the heavy synth beats. How do you envisage your live show changing as your popularity and discography expands?
EMMMA: The last time I toured, it was just me on the stage, so playing this new set with Ollie, my drummer was completely new. And just learning that it worked at all was learning! The more allowance we’re given, I’d like to add a few people; I play guitar and keys myself, but I’d like to add another guitarist and a bassist. It would be great to round out the stage a little bit more. But it probably won’t happen for a while as I’m pretty happy with what we have now. And Ollie is amazing, I’m gonna take him everywhere I go.
THE INDIEPENDENT: I want to talk about the ‘Whiplash’ video. I have described it as warrior meets butterfly. What inspired the video?
EMMMA: We were talking about the concept of ‘Whiplash’ and why I wrote it, and I think what came out of that discussion was there is power in being vulnerable. Speaking your truth is a very scary thing if you’re really delicate and truly vulnerable, but I think that’s where your strength comes from, and that’s why I put the butterfly and armour and I ran around in the studio with it on!
THE INDIEPENDENT: What EMMMA song should someone play on a first date to impress?
EMMMA: I’m gonna say ‘Whiplash’ because I feel like it’s kind of a slow jam. The vibe is a glass of red wine, cook some dinner and see what happens.
THE INDIEPENDENT: What made you relocate to the UK and, as an American artist, how are you finding it?
EMMMA: I am so deeply happy that I made the move. After living in L.A. for six years I felt so depressed, so sad and incredibly stifled so I went to London for four months in early 2024. I felt really at home in London and loved the creatives. I grew up in New York and I like the vibe, while I like the music industry of L.A.— that combined is my perfect city, London. It has the writing scene and the big-city feel that I craved in LA. So it just ended up being an absolute perfect place for me and I’m so thankful. It’s the best thing ever.
THE INDIEPENDENT: I’m not sure I would have traded the LA sunshine for weather like today, but…
EMMMA: I would. It was so monotonous, but the payoff of a sunny day in London, you can’t beat it! We want to go through a bit of the sludge to get the good stuff. In LA, you don’t have to work for it.
Tickets for EMMMA’s tour are available here
Interview by Andrew Butcher
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